Doing the right thing
Posted by Paul Cox on November 6th, 2009
- Integrity is our character. We do the right thing, even when no one is looking.
- People are our strength. We treat people as we want to be treated.
That’s from the FAA’s “mission statement“. We’ve talked here before about the folly of the FAA’s mission statement; we used to have a perfectly good one, but apparently the folks who ran the FAA several years back didn’t think it was good enough.
Here’s a snippet from the Wikipedia entry on mission statements:
Some mission statements are complex, long, and very broad, for example:
“Since its inception in 1982, La Unidad Latina has remained on the vanguard of political and community empowerment by developing influential leaders that strive to exert knowledge and power into its peers in order to attain mutual success. LUL is committed to academic excellence, leadership development and cultural enlightenment, enhanced by a diverse cognizant membership. LUL strives to preserve and promote an inclusive intellectual environment for its members, in addition to the general community.”
In contrast, some mission statements are simple and direct, for example:
“To protect and promote the interests of motorcyclists while serving the needs of its members.”
The classic example of the mission statement is the Preamble to the Constitution of the United States:
“We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.”
(That last one is a thing of beauty, isn’t it? It’s long, but it rolls in the purpose of our nation coming together- to form a better union, to establish justice… this is why we have the Constitution.)
The FAA’s mission statement used to be very simple: “We are responsible for the safe, orderly, and efficient movement of air traffic in the United States.” Gorgeous- simple and to the point. First and foremost- safety. Second- orderly. Third- efficient.
Now, of course, we have a bunch of crap that talks about how we want to treat others as we would like to be treated and so forth.
You’d think that we shouldn’t need that stuff in there, right? That the beginning part of our mission statement should lay it out well enough, and that something like treating people as we want to be treated should go without saying?
Sigh. As we pointed out in the previous entry, that’s not the case. It’s a pretty sad commentary on the state of affairs within the FAA that we had to actually put that into writing.
Anyway… doing the right thing. We talked the other day about how the employees of the FAA often think and act in ways that are like learned helplessness.
When you step back and think about it, saying “Yeah, that supervisor really screwed you over, but he’s usually a nice guy…” sounds just as stupid as the abused child that says “he was mean but usually he is nice” about the stepfather who puts out cigarette butts on the kid’s arm once in a while.
So if we accept that it’s wrong for our agency’s supervisors to abuse the agency’s employees, the next question is what is the right thing to do when a manager or supervisor carries out that abuse?
In theory, they’ll be corrected. They’ll be either retrained in the proper way to do things, or (if an investigation finds that they did it on purpose even though they knew better) they’ll be punished.
In practice, of course, it doesn’t work that way. In practice, over the past several years, the FAA’s air traffic managers have been given marching orders to protect supervisors and managers- even when they do something wrong.
Instead of being corrected, they’re allowed to continue their abuse. Instead of being retrained, or given some remedial “how to not be a big jerk” type of sensitivity training, they’re encouraged to “be strong managers” and “take charge”.
Here’s the problem with this… it leads to the type of scores on Employee Attitude Surveys that the FAA gets. There’s zero confidence (well, not ZERO, but very very very low) that the agency will treat its employees fairly and justly.
By “backing up the supervisors and managers” at any and all costs, the FAA winds up getting the opposite results that they claim to want. They back up these managers because, in theory, to punish them (or retrain them) would send a message that they are weak and their authority can be questioned.
In reality, what happens is that the employee sees a supervisor or manager doing something wrong, and then sees them get caught, and then sees them skate, and they lose confidence in the system. They distrust management to do the right thing. They know that upper levels of management do not have the worker’s back, so they will not believe anything that the manager says in the future.
This is the reason that it’s important that the FAA quit paying lip service to the notion of “we do the right thing” and actually start DOING the right thing. If a manager or supervisor screws over an employee, then do something about it. Don’t just apologize to the employee; do something to stop that from happening again.
THAT would build some trust among the employees.
Believe it or not, but many employees don’t mind working for a manager that asks for their best… as long as they know and trust that the manager will back them up when they’re in the right. Unfortunately, in today’s FAA, far far FAR too many employees feel exactly the opposite of this.
November 6th, 2009 at 7:06 am
I think we all need seriously look at why we give the biggest raises for promoting the least qualified people to FLMs? A 4% raise for a long term employee and a 20%+ raise for someone that has not proven themselves is ridiculous.
I think you will find the mission of many of these one year CPC wonders turned FLM is, avoid working traffic because I am scared, do anything and everything to retain my position, don’t lead I might come up with a bad idea, save the biggest idiot FLM’s job because if they let him go then I know I might be 2nd or 3rd in line. Read that last one again please. One reason to surround yourself with incompetence is that it makes you look better than you really are.
What do you think most FAA peons wish for when they run into a really poor FAA “Manager”? Not that they hope they get canned or demoted, they know that is unrealistic, THEY HOPE THE IDIOT GETS A PROMOTION!. This is because this is what usually happens. Not the problem gets fixed, or the manager gets training or mentoring, the only realistic way the problem is not yours anymore is that it becomes someone else’s problem!
The FAA promotes incompetence from the FLM level on up. To watch these dorks with their chests pumped out like they are actually somebody now that they can boss people around is laughable.
November 6th, 2009 at 7:22 am
Ask the facrep at BTV about their newest supe…if you’ve been with this agency long enough you’ll believe it, but not like it.
November 6th, 2009 at 7:23 am
I think another thing most people need to ask is if only 40-60% of trainees become controllers, how come 100% of the newly selected FLMs stay FLMs? Additionally you can get canned as a CPC for a laundry list of things, yet as a FLM you can sleep with married subordinates in your own area and a long list of other things and never lose a day’s pay over it. Even if you do it two or more times in different areas all you get is a transfer to another area until it happens yet again. This same person has never trained anybody (Due to being checked out barely a year) yet is giving check rides. WTF over.
Can’t manage their personal life, infidelity and in debt up to their ears yet in charge of people. That sound like a great recipe for a manager, that is what we got.
November 6th, 2009 at 8:20 am
FAA mission: We are responsible for the safe, orderly, and efficient movement of air traffic in the United States.
Twenty years ago – when I worked for the FAA – right out of college – the Division Manager would walk the halls and ask anyone in the office what the mission of the FAA was, everyone knew the answer because you never new when you would be asked. The mission of the FAA has not changed over all these years – nor should the mission statement. I think the FAA still accomplishes this mission.
November 6th, 2009 at 1:20 pm
“We treat people as we want to be treated.”
So freeze their pay already. They did it to us. That means they want it done to them. Don’t forget to fire them for checking the wrong box on their medical forms, among other things.
Management has way to many Rons in their ranks. We said: “please, no more Rons!!” but they just kept sending more Rons and more Rons…
November 6th, 2009 at 1:21 pm
Randy Babbitt’s Tombstone Agency FAA Credo:
“Safety Is Our Passion.
Quality Is Our Trademark.
Integrity Is Our Character.
People Are Our Strength.
Ennui Is Our Weltanschauung.
Entrails Are Our Legacy”.
To Randy Babbitt, from your friends at Quiet Rockland.
November 6th, 2009 at 7:40 pm
“FAA mission: We are responsible for the safe, orderly, and efficient movement of air traffic in the United States.
“Twenty years ago – when I worked for the FAA – right out of college – the Division Manager would walk the halls and ask anyone in the office what the mission of the FAA was, everyone knew the answer because you never new when you would be asked. The mission of the FAA has not changed over all these years – nor should the mission statement. I think the FAA still accomplishes this mission.”
This is the FAA’s current mission statement (it’s not far from the one you wrote):
Our Mission
Our continuing mission is to provide the safest, most efficient aerospace system in the world.
November 6th, 2009 at 7:59 pm
And just to again insult controllers, only FLMs or OMs can train people to be CIC’s. The FLMs can’t even run a shift without the colored alerts on sCRU-arts, nor make good decisions, but controllers are banned from training on the CIC postion? What BS.
November 6th, 2009 at 9:20 pm
Mokie,
Yes at one time you would find those words “We are responsible for the safe, orderly, and efficient movement of air traffic in the United States”; plain, simple and to the point….easy to remember and recite. It used to be in the 7110.65. Now it has changed to this: “The primary purpose of the ATC system is to prevent
a collision between aircraft operating in the system
and to organize and expedite the flow of traffic, and
to provide support for National Security and
Homeland Defense.”
They took something simple and clear to the point and mucked it up. Does it essentially say the same thing? Yes, 20 years ago I believe that everyone who worked in the FAA could recite the orginal version, I bet less than 5% could do so with the “new and imporved version”; this is the story of the FAA of late, take something plain and to the point and muck it up.
November 7th, 2009 at 1:49 am
Thanks for sharing such a nice article.
November 7th, 2009 at 8:08 am
The curious thing about all the flowery lingo in the mission statement is that when I see repeated real-world FAA management examples of the opposite, the mission statement only magnifies the opprobrium.
November 7th, 2009 at 9:27 am
I get so confused. Is having 24 trainees and 30 FPL’s providing or promoting safety? Ummm…what we need is more ads on busses. That will do it.
The good news is that we have 14 members of management to guide us. A 4-1 ratio. There’s a business model for ya.
November 7th, 2009 at 10:33 am
We have that ratio at ZAB also, talk about accountability and transparency in government. We have an opportunity to get ahead of the traffic right now but we are too worried about saving Overtime money, so some trainees barely get any training time.
Nice thing is we do the right thing even though nobody is watching. We have 4 FLMs in the building and stand up a CIC, it happens every day.
Sounds like we get to do ERAM if it works or not. I like how the flying public gets to test a system that should be much more thoroughly TESTED OFFLINE well before these live tests. Dropped elements in the flight plan and tracks that won’t track, sounds pretty dangerous to me. Hankie said he is not afraid to send his family through the system, maybe he should put his money where his mouth is and send his family through the system during every ERAM test. I know I wouldn’t.
November 7th, 2009 at 5:22 pm
Thanks for weighing in Junior, but what does this have to do with the current topic?
I’ll bet you don’t even know what ERAM stands for, much less URET!
Go peddle your venom elsewhere. We don’t care about the axe you have to grind.
November 7th, 2009 at 5:57 pm
“The curious thing about all the flowery lingo in the mission statement is that when I see repeated real-world FAA management examples of the opposite, the mission statement only magnifies the opprobrium.”
Nailed it on the head! Far too many years it has been do as we say and not as we do. Violation of rules that gets a lowly controller fired gets the manager promoted. Until the government forces the FAA to have accountability within the managerial ranks nothing will ever change. There are far too many “free passes” or look the other way within those ranks. In my many years of working for the FAA I have known only one management type get disciplined (a sup who was demoted back to the working ranks and transferred), but I have lost count on the number of controllers who have been disciplined or removed from their job for some violation (whether real or trumped up–remember the NY11). Does that mean that those in management all of a sudden become violation free when they move into those positions? No, it is has become a golden parachute for them instead, moving into a power position, getting paid more for it and no accountability for when they violate they rules they are supposed to enforce. I remember getting into a heated discussion about this with a regional person defending that they do discipline their own and cited a manager who was removed from their job for various violations……my arguement was it was not discipline when they promoted the person to another job. I say promoted because they took him from an ATM job and gave them a regional job which is considered a promotion. This person not only can receive points for the job he mucked up but also for the new job he got. Yeah, that showed him didn’t it, even got a paid move for his troubles. Then there was an ATM who retired rather than face the charges the IG was investigating him on……wonder how many controllers were afforded the same opportunity or would the controller have their retirement held up while the investigation/charges ran their course? There are two sets of standards within the FAA and until they start having accountability within the managerial ranks the problems will remain and the FAA will continue to score low on their surveys. The FAA doesn’t know the meaning of their own words.
November 7th, 2009 at 6:05 pm
“ERAM”, Brutus: “MARE” spelled backwards – a female animal. Definition of “Female animal”? A phenomenon no doubt prevalent in your family. “URET”, short for “URETER”, the very delivery-mechanism of your post and thoughts. Actually, the revised credo was spot-on. Once you stop carrying Randy’s jock for him, if ever, you might see so, too.
November 7th, 2009 at 6:10 pm
Paul, I might be wrong, but I believe the mission statement back in the day (circa 1984) was, “Air Traffic Control is defined as the safe, orderly, and expeditious movement of aircraft.”.
I no longer have my copy of the 7110.65C, but I believe the above to be correct.
Thanks as always for another great blog.
Grump(ret.)
November 8th, 2009 at 1:48 am
Brutus,
ERAM’s failure has everything to do with the current topic.
We do the right thing even though nobody is watching.
The right thing to do would be not put the flying public in danger with a system that takes 20 to 45 minutes to recover into Host with live traffic being worked by unprepared controllers (Some with no EDARC training on live traffic in years)
We treat others the way we want to be treated?
How about Hankie putting his family on a plane that flies through ERAM testing sectors? I know I would not put mine on a flight though that. The flying public has no clue we are testing a dysfunctional system on LIVE TRAFFIC and only by luck nothing major has not happened.
How about a real MOU for ERAM that could stop this insanity of going forward with an unproven system being tested on live traffic?
Only after catastrophic failures at ZLC was a contingency plan even thought of, shouldn’t that be part of the game plan? Fall back? More like fall to your knees and pray.
So before you go calling someone “Junior” learn how to read AND comprehend or have mommy read it to you and explain. My points have everything to do with the topic, yours has nothing, now who is the idiot that is not on topic….well that’s you. Too easy.
November 8th, 2009 at 10:00 am
E(lectronic) R(ape) A(nd) M(urder)
Is that the answer you were looking for there, Brutus, Senior?
Or is there a “patch” out and now it’s all better?
A better question: Is the system legit and ready for primetime or not? If not, what’s the hurry?
The perception is it’s being pushed hard by weasels that stand to profit from it’s implementation. The program pushes forward at operational control sites in the field in spite of numerous and often onerous work-arounds that are apparently being relegated to techs and controllers. This is after identifying and fixing(?) major flaws.
Controllers have no such profit incentive, therefore, can be far more concerned with “doing the right thing” and safety.
Bottom line is ERAM has failed to inspire confidence all on its own, no axe, no grind, no ulterior motives- deal with it.
November 8th, 2009 at 1:44 pm
“Paul, I might be wrong, but I believe the mission statement back in the day (circa 1984) was, “Air Traffic Control is defined as the safe, orderly, and expeditious movement of aircraft.”.”
The first “mission statement” I remember seeing was about the time QTP started.
November 9th, 2009 at 3:59 pm
Interesting…….the past FAA management that suddenly retired….suddenly left with their pensions literally destroyed FAA credibility. Is it a mistake that FAA is number #213 out of #213 the worst place in the government to work.
Sabatini and Ballough have pissed on the integrity of the FAA. Integrity and character has no place under Sabatini. It was more like corruption, cronyism and a good old boy retired cop’s club.
Integrity and character. ?????? no way!
November 11th, 2009 at 2:33 pm
ACRO and SNAPPY,
Funny how you too (two) hide behind the mask of the JUNIOR!
LONG LIVE THE JUNIOR!!!
November 12th, 2009 at 2:30 pm
Just so you guys know that I was a supe and I suffered a serious brain injury that precluded me from ever working again. I mean at anything, not just as a sup or a controller. So I was 10 months from retirement and the manager at a Center basically threw me out. He said I had to take sick leave, (which I had already exhausted)or I had to go out on LWOP, which he would only approve for 6 months. I asked to please let me stay and he basically said FU and leave. So I asked him to approve 6 months of LWOP and let me come back for 3 lousy months so I could retire. Once again the answer was FU. There were 3 controllers there who were medically disqualified and were working staff jobs, which were basically make work positions. One had been eligible to retire 10 or 15 years ago, however he was still working in a staff job, on detail from a controller position. He was disqualified because he was taking medication because he was “too stressed” to do the job.. So why wasn’t I afforded the opportunity to work in one of those jobs? I don’t know for sure but I think it has something to do with the manager having to spend money on a guy who was getting ready to retire but he had no meaningful work, even though there were 3 controllers who were medically disqualified, working in staff jobs that had been made up just for them. I’m very grateful that I qualified for a disability retirement, which if you know anything about can be VERY difficult to get. This is just to let you know that not all supes are treated in a special way by management.
Rick
November 12th, 2009 at 3:06 pm
I wish I could say I felt sorry for you, but I don’t. Sound sour, callous, and cold hearted? So was ramming the white book up my cheeks.
At least you can still ride off in the sunset with your last 3 years of pay raises IN YOUR BASE on the backs of the controllers. I can’t count how many controllers left the FAA this past year with hope that they would get pay raises in retirement to get a ZERO raise this coming year. You guys collectively helped ruin people’s lives and livelihood.
Look back at your life, look deeply at what you did as a supe and really examine how far reaching your personal actions (Or lack of actions) where to making the white book nightmare a reality for thousands of controllers.
I call it KARMA.
November 12th, 2009 at 8:44 pm
Rick, sorry you had such a rude awakening. No the faa doesn’t give a **** about you either. Welcome to the club. No sarcasm intended.
Yes, you were a disposable instrument of change. If you ever thought differently, you were delusional. They don’t care about the controllers, the techs, the secretaries, or the custodians. They only care about covering their own ass. Sorry you were a victim.
I’m sure every large facility has it’s share of med disqualified guys who milk the system for years after they are eligible to go. They generally think they are God’s gift and are irreplaceable.
November 13th, 2009 at 6:55 am
i miss the old FAA,they hated our guts but a least they were up front about it and let us do our jobs without all the petty bull ****.
November 13th, 2009 at 1:23 pm
Zabnut,
All I can say is wow. I was just trying to illustrate that management doesn’t always take care of supes like you guys are saying. And just so you know, this happened to me in early ’06. I was a supe for a total of 5 months. I had nothing to do with the white book nor did I get any raises to my base pay. I was forced to retire on disability. At least you get to keep working and making what you’re making instead of making a lousy 56% of what my base pay was, not inclusding CIP, night pay, holiday pay,and sunday pay. But I’m not bitter. I feel sorry for you, because of all the bitterness in your life. I would find a way to blow off some steam if I were you, before you have a stroke. As far as being bitter, it’s ceratinly understandable, but don’t let it become a cancer man. It’s not good for you.
You also said ” I can’t count how many controllers left the FAA this past year with hope that they would get pay raises in retirement to get a ZERO raise this coming year.” Are you referring to the fact that people who retire this year get no raise? If you are then you must know that it has nothing to do with the FAA. It has to do with the CPI-W. NO federal retirees get a raise this year (including me). It’s not the FAA’s fault, it’s inflations fault.
I DID look back at my life, deeply as you said, and I think I’ve had a positive affect on people’s lives. All of the controllers I supervised were treated with respect and kindness. None of the B.S. that other supes pulled. If you want you can send me an e-mail at squishO90@hotmail.com and I will give you the name of the facility I worked at and the area phone number and you can ask the controllers yourself at least the ones who are still there and those who remember me.
I will pray for you my man because you need it more than me.
If you believe in KARMA I would watch out if I were you.
Rick
November 13th, 2009 at 7:09 pm
LOL I could care less, you are FAA former management puke pissing and moaning that controllers got jobs made for them and not you.
My point with my friends retiring early due to no pay raises then getting none in retirement is THEY WOULD NOT HAVE RETIRED IF YOU WOULD HAVE STOOD UP FOR THE RIGHT THING. I understand mr genius that it was chance they get zero raise this coming year, all but a smallest number would have stayed but couldn’t due to what collective part you took in the IWR.
If you looked back at your life and see that you actually affect people much further than you could ever imagine then you would understand what I am talking about, instead you deflect the argument and veiled in some wacko concern for my health. Laughable at best, stop living a lie and come to terms with yourself, you where part of the problem and not a solution.
I really believe in karma bubba and just because I am not crying for your little misfortune doesn’t make me a bad person, just one being honest with you. No matter what you took this personally and I could care less. I am not happy of your little problem nor do I care, I don’t know you and don’t ever care to.
No matter how bad you dream you have it, you got away with 3 years of BIG raises on the backs of those people you “took care of”
No matter how bad you think you got screwed you took the livelihood from THOUSANDS of controllers by taking part of the koolaid fest in the FAA by carrying the company line. If you think you didn’t then prove you tried to fight the white book! Prove you did anything to document your fight to help others, other people than the 4 or 5 people you supervised. You helped 4 or 5 people and helped 14,000 controllers take it in the shorts. That sound like you did your part in life? I think all in all even if you where to best supe in the entire agency you still did more harm than good if you did nothing to fight the IWR.
Do me a favor and lay off the praying for me and stop the I would watch out for KARMA BS. I know what I did in life and I am not worried.
In case you had not noticed this is a blog about controllers, we don’t give a rat’s A$$ what happened to you or your kind.
This is also the internet I don’t know you so go ahead and carry on a conversation with nobody. I told you plain and simple I don’t care, I don’t care what you think now go post some crap in FAAMA board and get some sympathy from the snake pit there.
November 14th, 2009 at 5:20 am
“So was ramming the white book up my cheeks.”
There wasn’t a single FLM, OM, or ATM that was responsible for the direction that the negotiations took when the parties sat down in 2005 to discuss what would eventually become the white book.
November 14th, 2009 at 6:59 am
ZabNUT serves as a fine name for you my friend. LOL In case can’t you read I said this happened to me in early ’06, long before the white book. I had nothing to do with the IWR. NOthing. And I’m not sure you missed it but I said I got NO raises to my base pay, none. Not on the backs of controllers not on the backs of anyone. Once again I got no raises. I was forced to retire on disability. ANd I’m not living a lie, I beleive it is you who is living in fantasy with all this blind hatred. Let it go dude it isn’t good for you.
ANd as far as you being a bad person, I would disagree there also. To argue that money is more important than a person’s health. well health is something no amount of money could buy. And I’m not looking for sympathy from you , just trying to illustrate your blind hatred and bitterness. What if this happened to a controller and management made him retire you would be shouting from the highest rooftop how callous management is. Once again don’t let it become a cancer man it isn’t good for you.
And what did YOU do about the IWR’s besides bitching and moaning on a bulletin board? Probably nothing and I know why, because you could have lost your job if you took it too far. Well what do you think the sup’s were faced with. And almost none of us who tried to go back to the controller ranks were allowed to.
As far as proving what I did in my fight to help others is just a phone call away.
And I could be wrong, I’ll have to ask Paul, but this is a blog about the FAA, not about controllers.
And I will continue to pray for you, because you need it man you really do.
And the KARMA will get you if it’s meant to be
God Bless you
Rick
November 14th, 2009 at 7:08 am
you know what Zabnut, I just reread your post about the part where you said I took this personally and you know what? You’re right. I wish I could take back my posts but I can’t. You’re right. All FAA amangement is scum (almost all of them). I also have no desire to communicate with you in any form either. Nothing personal, just an internet thing. Sorry.
Rick
November 14th, 2009 at 9:22 am
But FAAguy you said the white book was a contract, I got the speech several times from “managers”. Obviously it was legally what the FAA could do, because they did it, a contract it was not.
Every single management person that sat there and did nothing at all while this sham of set of work rules was laid down took part of this. Every “manager” that continued to break even the white book rules because they felt they could run rough shot over the troops because they already got one over by imposing the white book on an unwilling workforce will get their due.
When the congress charged the FAA to run more like a business I totally agree with that idea. Instead of watching management costs and spending money wisely we contracted out critical systems, removed redundancy on those same systems and treated controllers like widget makers to “improve” productivity that insured you would have an angry workforce for decades to come. We should have been buying off the shelf systems and computers at CURRENT prices instead of buying 65 inch plasmas a year and 1/2 before deployment and losing one due to theft.
All in all each one of you “managers” took part in this by not speaking up and doing your part to stop this frenzy, ahhh but all the time huge bonuses where coming to town, don’t want to anger the FAA pay raise Santa. Let controller staffing run into the ground to improve productivity then leave them in a terrible position years later struggling to train so many new people at the same time all while ballooning management staffing to 3 or 4 to 1 (How does that improve productivity? Well it doesn’t.) We have been told over and over Management will work the boards thats why we hired so many, they are all going to get R-sides to help out and staff sectors 2 or 3 days a week, guess what NOTHING HAS HAPPENED.
Run like a business? All I see is the next buzz word bingo briefing not action. You guys are no better off than ERON management that sold their workforce out. All the time beating the drum, THIS IS A CONTRACT ALL IS WELL. Staffing is plummeting (Las vegas has less than 25 CPCs, Denver Tracon has 26 or less CPC) Keep looking at the numbers they both have so few they can’t train people on all the sectors. IF they where all checked out they would have full staffing, instead of promoting from lower level facilities we combined others approach controllers and brought them there, now we have no other options but hire off the street and attempt to check them out on even more sectors, guess what they are not making it! Not to mention the paid moves we wasted money on and the retirements that happened right afterwards, too laughable.
Would you guys be the ones that would tell employees to keep your stock in the company and buy more? You already have.
And Rick go blow it out your A$$ I could care less you tool. Your facility actually did the right thing and took care of the people that worked (Controllers) and let you go, bottom line is you still got your retirement. They probably took you for someone that would take advantage of an offer to keep you until you can officially retire then stay until 56 or much much later doing nothing. We got several at our work too. Oh yeah please pray for me you A$$hat and keep telling me KARMA will get me. You keep coming back for more is unreal, you have nothing better to do in retirement? I have a sad life? Take a look in the mirror bubba you sound like the guy that needs the daily affirmation like Stuart Smally. Go back to your old facility and see what kind of lukewarm reception you get. Last tool like you that showed up trying to make amends for all the bad they did in life was ignored by many including me. Right after you leave the talk will start, “WTF was he here for?” “He got nothing better to do in life?” “Once an A-hole always an A-hole” “He thinks he has friends here” You keep in touch with any of your former subordinates, they call you, they come to see you? I know my address book has every controller buddy I ever worked with in it, not a single “Manager”.
My oldest controller buddy started in 1958, I started in the ’80s, he told me management has never gotten better only worse over the years. I took that with a grain of salt in the ’80s, then he told me to watch very closely and by god he was right. It got worse, much worse. For the first time in the ’90s we start seeing people with 1 year CPC getting promoted and OMs with 2 or 3 years TOTAL on the boards, I knew we where in trouble. So Big Dick, you did plenty to help this train wreck happen even if you don’t think so, same for you FAAMAGUY, You are no better than a NAZI paper pusher was in the ’30s and no more innocent. You took a part even the slightest in ruining lives, FSS losing retirement, controllers retiring early or resigning.
lets see traffic pick up even the slightest bit and see who is right? I think it will be me. I see who we are checking out, they are scared to death to work the limited traffic we have, heaven help us. Shaky people DO get better with practice, scared people NEVER do, they become management.
November 14th, 2009 at 9:43 am
Zabnut you are a sad, sad litle man.
November 14th, 2009 at 10:06 am
You stated nothing that addressed my assertion.
November 14th, 2009 at 12:27 pm
You really think a temp sup who was forced out in ’06, before the IWRs, could have changed the course of the faa? You think he should carry the blame for the FSS bone job? Rick may have been the world’s biggest A-hole. I have no idea, but he’s not the cause of your problems.
Your rage makes you incoherent.
November 14th, 2009 at 3:42 pm
Rick, Looks like ZABNUT hit a nerve. I agree 100% with his post.
Get rid of every supe ,OM and manager for that matter and see how it affects the traffic. It doesn’t ! Things would run smoother….not to mention the savings to taxpayers. They fired the wrong people in 1981.
November 15th, 2009 at 11:48 am
Rick, Here is how it works with me. As long as you are a union controller I will do everything to help you and be a friend. As soon as you BID a management job I will not give you the time of day or have anything to do with you. Zabnut is right on the money with his post.
November 16th, 2009 at 10:19 am
Sct controller you said “Rick, Looks like ZABNUT hit a nerve.”
I think it is just the opposite. It is he who is bleating on about nazis and whatever. Do you really think that it was nazi like when the FAA implemented the white book and the way management treated you? Even though it was heavy handed, to compare the FAA or FAAguy or me to a nazi seems a little bit on the psychotic side don’t you think? Who was killed? Who was forcibly dragged out of thier home in the middle of the night and shot or forced to work until they died? Who had everyhing taken from him? And I don’t mean a pension, I mean everything. I know it was bad working for the FAA, but come on, give me a break. I think whoever wrote above that his rage makes him incoherent was right.
And Heavy D, I’m not asking for any help or to be anybody’s friend, or for anybody to have anything to do with me. All I was trying to do was to illustrate that the FAA management doesn’t always take care of it’s own. Sheesh.
And Zabnut, I gave just shy of $2000 dollars a year to the NATCA PAC for 3 years running. Even after I became a supervisor. In fact I was the highest contributor in the facility I worked at, with nearly 300 controllers, even as a supervisor. How much did you give? So who did more to help overturn the white book? Me or you?
Rick
November 16th, 2009 at 1:09 pm
Old internet truism.
The longer an internet disagreement goes on, the chance of a nazi/hitler comparison goes way up.
November 16th, 2009 at 4:00 pm
If you belong, or did belong, to supcom or faama, then you did indeed help create this mess.
They did get input from faa atm’s, om’s and other stupes on what they wanted in the “new contract”.
This is a mess.
My facility….
44% trainees. There’s safety for you.
November 16th, 2009 at 5:19 pm
Rick, Stop making excuses. You were part of the problem. The end ! You get NO RESPECT FROM ME or anyone else that was on the receiving end of you being a supervisor.
Like I said, the FAA could get rid of every supe, OM and ATM and things would run smoother.
Please tell me again how YOU made a difference.
The FSS guys who lost their pensions are a perfect example of the NAZI tactics the FAA used.
November 16th, 2009 at 7:17 pm
“You get NO RESPECT FROM ME or anyone else that was on the receiving end of you being a supervisor.”
How the hell do you know?
November 17th, 2009 at 8:48 am
“So who did more to help overturn the white book? Me or you?”
Rick
Obama overturned the Bush Blakey IWRS. He proposed it in 2006 in a then Senate bill(stymied by the then Republican “leadership”)and he kept his word to NATCA and sent FAA and NATCA back to the table once he became POTUS.
Executive action, not legislative, fixed the IWRs….so your PAC contributions had nothing to do with it.
And if you voted McBush Rick, you voted to continue the IWRS….maybe worse.
November 17th, 2009 at 5:25 pm
SCT controller wrote “The FSS guys who lost their pensions are a perfect example of the NAZI tactics the FAA used.” Oh really? Tell that to th 6 million people who were murdered. Not even close to being even remotely close to anything that could be described as even being remotely nazi. And I’m not looking for respect from you or anyone else. Get a grip fella, your incoherent factor is rising.
TX ACTS, I did not belong to FAAAMA, and never would. I suppose I did belong to supcom because every supervisor belongs to supcom whether they were “active” or not, so I guess I was part of the problem.
AS@SCT I wasn’t aware that NATCA didn’t give any pac contributions to Obama, or to a committee or some other entity that had as it’s purpose to elect Obama, my bad. Of course NATCA Zxx and NATCA national were happy to have my money. And weren’t they telling people to contribute to the PAC so we could get a democratic house and senate so we WOULD have a legislative fix to the IWR’s. I think you may be putting a fine point on it AS@SCT. But I take your point.
And I didn’t and never would vote McBush. Not that it’s any of anyone business. My conscience is clear on that point anyway.
Rick
November 17th, 2009 at 5:34 pm
And also AS@SCT, isn’t there a fix in some bill so this never happens again? I think that would qualify as legislative action. And I know with the republicans in charge that it would never be in any bill. Not trying to start a flame war with you, just pointing out something I thought of after I posted the last post.
Rick