Mmmm… that’s tasty crow!
Posted by Paul Cox on September 25th, 2009
Apparently it’s a good thing I’m not big into gambling. Oh, I’ll play some blackjack (but I learned how to count cards). I’ll throw a few bucks on a spin of the roulette wheel, play a few other games. But the local Indian (feather, not red-dot Indians) tribe has a casino right next to Seattle Center and I probably haven’t bet more than a few hundred dollars in the 15 years or so it’s been open.
Like I said, this is a good thing. I ran for FacRep, would have bet on myself, and lost. (Bad bet- I don’t think an incumbent has lost at ZSE, ever, and my opponent was the sitting VP and effectively an incumbent. Plus he’s a hell of a nice guy.)
I would have bet on Ruth Marlin winning the runoff… bad bet. Paul Rinaldi’s supporters did a better job of Ruth’s in getting out the vote, and I would have lost that bet too. (And I, along with all of the rest of Ruth’s supporters, owe her an apology- we let her down and didn’t work hard enough.)
I also recently predicted that the NATCA Contract might be in danger of failing to ratify. It passed with a 97% margin voting in favor. I thought the more people that voted, the more danger it would be in.
WOW. Well, like I said, I’m not gambling on these notions I have, which is a good thing!
So we’ve got a contract. We’ll all be in jeans and sneakers in a week or so. Our FacReps are marching into facility chiefs’ offices all across the nation with proposals for vacation bids, schedules, and a whole host of other things.
What does this mean to Joe Member? And given my recent dismal history, would anyone pay attention to a guess?
What the heck, I’ll make one anyway. Other than the obvious pay bumps that are coming to many NATCA members, at first I’m not entirely sure we’re going to see a lot of changes. Many facilities are still understaffed; those 6-day workweeks aren’t going anywhere for FAR too many of our controllers.
Those same staffing problems are likely to lead to the same kinds of deals on vacation that we’ve seen in the past few years. We might see a lot of facilities wind up at impasse over leave/schedule negotiations.
Yeah, no dress code… except that many facility managers have already proclaimed that they will not allow things that were allowed under the “Green Book”. This is despite the fact that that the Red Book (the color of the new contract) language is identical to that of the Green Book.
(Nobody said these managers were smart.)
What do you hope to see in your facility? What changes do you think will actually come about, and what changes that have been discussed do you think are going to be killed by an obstinate, stupid management corps that brought us the disaster of the past few years?
September 25th, 2009 at 5:29 am
I’ve talked to a manager who is absolutely 100% sure that Flip flops are excluded in the contract. I told him I had heard the article is identical to the green book. He doesn’t believe it. My point is, he’s getting this shit from somewhere, not making it up. They (the controllers haters in the FAA) are not going away without some petty resistance over the dress code and other items.
September 25th, 2009 at 6:03 am
I expect to see a lot of paperwork filed on our OM.
September 25th, 2009 at 6:54 am
I’ve seen the FAA’s proposal for Article 69. It included the current language (identical to green book) plus a list of inappropriate attire items that were subsequently crossed out. Since the FAA proposed this and was not subsequently agreed upon, it attempt to enforce something they did not get at the bargaining table is an Unfair Labor Practice.
We had this issue come up at ZAB yesterday because of “guidance” management received on the new contract and we squashed it.
September 25th, 2009 at 7:29 am
You may not be a very successful betting man, but your Blog is FIRST RATE! The info you put out on this blog is a MUST READ for ANYONE in the FAA.
Even for us Airway Facilities types.You have helped me and lots of PASS members with the “FOLLIES”.Please KEEP IT UP!
September 25th, 2009 at 7:41 am
“But the local Indian (feather, not red-dot Indians) tribe” <– seriously?
September 25th, 2009 at 10:28 am
Pat Forrey thanks Ducharme? Faa focus today
September 25th, 2009 at 11:14 am
Scopedope, it was “An emotional Forrey thanked Rich DuCharme”. Apparently Patty-cakes was overcome. Why else would he ever bother to thank one of the chief perpetrators of the crap of the last 3 years?
September 25th, 2009 at 9:28 pm
Not only is the language of the Red Book identical to the Green Book on dress code, the briefing guide says that the intent is identical. I’m sure some managers will make a fuss over the issue and numerous grievances will be required to fix them.
This time though, the FAA will be paying the arbitration fees, not splitting them with NATCA. More taxpayer money wasted. What’s new?
September 26th, 2009 at 5:40 pm
My question for controller, FFA, NATCA, hiring panel, managers, supes, etc, is when will my application be looked at? I have heard that there will be no hiring FY2010.. Did they want to keep the controllers working 6 day weeks?
September 26th, 2009 at 6:26 pm
Paul,
I enjoy your blog and find it informative but I would ask that you edit your little joke out. Some will find it offensive.
September 27th, 2009 at 7:20 am
According to this July 2009 update:
The agency plans to hire 3,442 controllers in the next two years against expected losses of 3,133,
http://www.faa.gov/news/updates/?newsId=58674
September 27th, 2009 at 8:17 am
FAAGuy: That’s what the agency says. The reality, is they’re trying to run more people through he academy than it can handle, and the average wait time from application to report date is still more than a year and a half. “right people, right place, right time..” Yeah, Right. I applied in May 2008 and report Nov. 27th 2009. The hiring process is a joke, and it’s broken.
September 27th, 2009 at 8:48 am
Faa guy, can you please send me your email so that we can discuss? I resigned in 08 for numerous reasons, may be you can help me out, have already been to radar training academy, Id like to expidite the process before Im too old. Thank you.
September 27th, 2009 at 9:58 am
Peter,
You would hire in as a re-instatement. There is a re-instatement announcement currently open, but it closes 9/30, so you’ll have to act quickly. It used to be that re-instsatements were hired more quickly than a person that had no prior ATC experience. I do not know if that is the current practice though.
http://jobview.usajobs.gov/getjob.aspx?JobID=79660836&q=Reinstatement&fn=4651&FedEmp=Y&sort=rv&vw=d&brd=3876&jbf574=TD03&ss=0&FedPub=N&caller=%2fa9TD03i.asp&submit1.x=108&submit1.y=12&AVSDM=2009-05-16+12%3a32%3a00&rc=8&TabNum=1
September 27th, 2009 at 10:13 am
The FAA will be hiring “trainees” not controllers. We have trainees hired in 2007 that aren’t even close to being finished.
September 27th, 2009 at 10:23 am
Peter, I’m not sure, but don’t think the age restriction applies to you since you have already been hired.
September 27th, 2009 at 11:32 am
Vector,
FAA mis-management will never get it. They go to National jobs and are “Checked out” on what they do the day they show up. It doesn’t take much to learn how to play minesweeper, to stay away from your desk 7 hours a day (Go visit national or regional, it looks like there is nobody working there. Better yet call several numbers and see if you actually talk to somebody). Right, these are the same people stroking themselves about OUR productivity and how much we get paid.
We have people that started the hiring process prior to 2006, where at the academy during the IWR change over and HAVE NO R-SIDES. These people are under “Dis-Functional training” and are suppose to be on the fast track. I wish it was a few, but I would say at least 1/2 of them are no where close to being checked out. The real scary part is traffic is WAY down and we still can’t check these people out. Lets stop and really think about what I am saying.
We start on the easiest sectors in the area for ANY training. That only makes sense. Most of these people have 120 + (After extensions) hour PER sector they are training on. During D-sides they all got hundreds of hours of glorified “Stick time” for each of the other sectors. Some where recycled, some where moved to other ares, others where seasoned and stopped training then got fam-time for a hundred hours more. Exactly what holds up someone from getting checked out, seriously what exactly are most of us are looking for? I know we look at the training form and look at the first 5 items on the check list. Especially A1s. ARE THEY SAFE? Some our FLMs check out anyhow because they didn’t have an A1 that day working 6 to 10 airplanes at most.
We have people that are unsafe to work alone that have A1s working 6-10 airplanes. AFTER HUNDREDS of HOURS BEHIND THE SCOPE. Traffic will be back. Working 6 airplanes and working 25 can not just be worked up to IMO. If you can’t work 6 you can never work 25 safely.
These people are in no way, shape or form “Controllers”, they are trainees until the day they get checked out. Go ahead and hire 6,000 trainees and lose 3,000 we are WAY behind the power curve. When I got hired we had 60+ CONTROLLERS in my area working about the same traffic we have today (Albeit much less automation) We now have less than 30, with I think 25 in training. There are many shifts with more trainees than controllers in the area.
IF WE HAD HIRED CONTROLLERS I would be able to get spot leave any time I wanted. IF WE HAD HIRED CONTROLLERS leave picks would not be a problem. IF WE HAD HIRED CONTROLLERS we would not be using any overtime. IF WE HIRED CONTROLLERS I would not be pushing 2 hours on position every single day.
September 27th, 2009 at 4:32 pm
Nice post Paul. I see Johnny Carr has done a mea culpa too. Now, if we coud only get one from Bob Marks, the biggest loser our Union has seen for a long time. I think the membership was concerned that Marlin and Co. would have opened the Union coffers for the Gilding fiasco. Tough luck Marks. And don’t think about bidding that staff or sup job. Why don’t you go back to the Post Office where you belong?
September 27th, 2009 at 4:46 pm
Zabnut, while I agree with all you post here, doesn’t your lumping all those management people into the same class make you a bigot?
Just sayin’
Burger boy, stick with that burger flipin job. You’re well suited to it. The world needs ditch diggers too, son.
September 27th, 2009 at 6:44 pm
Nice Try,
I have been to the national and regional offices and my comment speaks for itself. I know what goes on there and it would be hard pressed for anyone to call it “Work”. They are not in their offices in significant numbers to the effect that it looked like was a federal holiday we had somehow missed and they didn’t. I have yet to call a national number and speak with any individual, without playing phone tag EVER. The FAA management types have repeatedly droned, we have hired enough CONTROLLERS when all we have hired are TRAINEES that less than 1/4 have actually become controllers since 2006.
There is a big difference in OPINION or someone declaring an OBSERVATION and someone being a BIGOT. So NICE TRY, I read what I posted and I don’t see any bigotry there. I made a quip from the movie Tropic Thunder, “What do you mean, YOU PEOPLE” and it got blown way out of proportion.
Give it a rest or grow up, maybe a little of both iffen you can manage that, son.
(WOW, that made me feel like a big boy calling someone son, online) It made you look like an idiot, imagine that. As if your 9th grade level posts didn’t do the trick already. Take a little time to look real hard in the mirror and see what everyone else is laughing at.
Geesh
/sarcasm off
September 27th, 2009 at 11:50 pm
Burger Boy,
Correct me if I’m wrong, but at the last NATCA Convention didn’t the delegates vote to open the coffers in support of John and Bob? The travesty is that Pat decided he didn’t have to follow the will of the Union.
I find it hard to comprehend your mockery of Bob. He has given much for his NATCA brothers and sisters. You say “our Union;” are you really a member? Your posting doesn’t seem to display the basic knowledge of what a Union is. It would be nice to lend a helping hand to a former leader who is currently enduring hardship because of his service; instead you kick him while he is down.
Kind Regards,
Todd Wilhelm
Charter NATCA Member, retired 2008
September 28th, 2009 at 6:29 am
I only hope that I never have to work with a Gary Smades or Jim Kemp again. Both PATCO re-hires that were POS ! They gave the re-hires a very bad name.
September 28th, 2009 at 6:45 am
We have about 12 more people at the MSS 2 and above pay grade assigned to SCT, then we did 3 years ago.
What doesn’t add up is the ratios.
Fewer total MSS 1s(CPCs, trainees, TMCs and staff), traffic down probably 6-8 percent from three years ago, but 12 more “managers”.
We have 40 more trainees then we did then, the vast majority of whom have never been controllers anywhere before. Other than that other than a dip in traffic, nothing has changed.
So why the bulge in management ranks ?
September 28th, 2009 at 6:58 am
FAA Guy thanks, I have applied for that last July. I look forward to some more of your posts/responses, may be we can keep in touch. Hiring panel? I heard they were supposed to meet in Mid september, but $ ra out so they were thinking the end of october.. Is there anyone I can speak with about this that has a CONCRETE answer?
September 28th, 2009 at 9:15 am
It is controllers like Zabnut and SCT controller that will keep ‘you people’ an association rather that a UNION.
September 28th, 2009 at 10:49 am
Rehired,
Our association just ratified a contract so I am plenty happy with our little group.
I have to agree with SCT, I worked with way too many PATCO rehires and they made our job a living hell. I liked many of them personally but others were like this REHIRE guy, tools. Laughable that none that I knew joined NATCA. Bitter old men where the majority of them, all in over their heads.
AS@SCT, the FAA is promoting all over the agency. there is a long line of people happy to sell their soul for a few dollars.
Peter Griffin,
My suggestion to you would be go to Stuckmic.com and ask there, there are a lot of people in the know there and a FORUM where questions could be posed there instead of hijacking someone’s blog.
September 28th, 2009 at 11:24 am
Zabnut, it sounds like the original brainwashing the FAA gave years and years after the STRIKE worked on you. I guess you’ll be getting one of those management jobs real soon. I don’t see any bigotry in your retort, hee hee.
September 28th, 2009 at 12:53 pm
ROFL.
I had a few PATCO rehire friends, most chose to stick to themselves and ended up bitter old people after the strike .
Liking some of a group makes me a bigot? What ever.
No brainwashing required to figure out an illegal strike helped me get a job. I thank God that I am in this association called NATCA.
September 28th, 2009 at 5:28 pm
AS email me at dale1122@gmailDOTcom please, been wanting to talk to you. You know me from FL years ago.
September 29th, 2009 at 4:44 am
Zabnut, keep your eye on the FAA party line. thank God that you’ll never be a UNION person.
September 29th, 2009 at 6:50 am
Kemp was OK, Smades was a complete jackass.
We had another rehire, big right winger, always ragging on Clinton.
I reminded him one day that it was Clinton that hired him back and signed the bill in to law that funded reclass.
Not only did he lose his medical and play OM phone boy for three or four years, even after he was eligible to retire, they made up a do nothing staff job for him that he worked for a couple of more years.
Biggest hypocrite amongst the rehire set, hands down.
September 29th, 2009 at 7:05 am
Right now, I would have to say that the NATCA leadership at SCT is the best it has ever been in years. I am proud to be a part of it ,especially as we try and recover from the past 3 years of the she devil (BLAKEY). It still perplexes me how anyone in NATCA ever voted for Bush/McCain. Had McCain won there would be NO new contract and we may have very well been working for Lockheed Martin or Rayethon.
September 29th, 2009 at 9:58 am
Smades is proof that ORD TRACON is one of the best kept secrets in the FAA. He was a POS controller at LA after coming there from ORD. Ask Yvonne, who went from LA to ORD, and checked out in a matter of weeks.
September 29th, 2009 at 2:23 pm
ORD’s egos are way to big. A problem they have had for many years. Bill Scott came to SCT and could not seperate the cheeks of his ass so he bid a supes job. Smades was always a big POS wherever he went. ORD, SCT, LAS and MIA. Every facilty could not wait to see him leave.
September 30th, 2009 at 12:14 pm
Y’all sound like whining kids. All I ever hear from you guys is wahh wahh wahh
Management = EVIL
Us poor worker bees = TROD UPON
You have good jobs that pay more than a LOT in the USA, how about you try to be happy and stop thinking you have such a raw deal. This public badmouthing of management is in very poor taste. And no, I am not in management. I’ve only been here in the FAA for two years.
If this is how union people think (poor me ALL the time) I want nothing to do with them. You end up becoming like those with whom you associate.
September 30th, 2009 at 1:02 pm
ASI-Airworthiness,
2 YEARS IN THE FAA ? Give me a break ! You have no idea what we have been through. walk a mile in my shoes and then make an educated statement but until then STFU !!!
It is not all about $$$$. It is about respect.
Can’t wait to hear what you have to say when you actually have put your time in.
September 30th, 2009 at 2:19 pm
ASI, you can thank these whiny union people for your $8k yearly raise for the next 3 years, you fucking hypocrite.
September 30th, 2009 at 3:12 pm
Sorry Guys but ASI is right and wearing shorts and t-shirts is not a victory. By the way I have 25 years, all ATC-12 ARTCC, all on the boards and a charter member. Flame Away!